Finally, the album reaches its grandiose ending and reveals that the secret behind the carnival was really…God? Sure enough, their rape fantasies and necrophilia tributes were all orchestrated by the creator of humanity, or at least that’s what the clowns say.
This quotation is about the Insane Clown Posse’s “Shangri-La” album. If you don’t know ICP, they are gangsta rappers who dress like clowns. No, literally, LIKE CLOWNS:
As if this weren’t enough, their songs about bitches and guns lead to the apocalypse. You see, every album is a “joker card” which brings us closer to the apocalypse/understanding what the ICP is really about. At this juncture, ICP fans will go to Shangri-La in a clown spaceship. I could not make this stuff up.
And that sixth joker card is the album I received in the mail today. Actually there are 2 parts to the sixth joker card, and I have part one. Like any good religion there’s a lot of revising of the juggalo mythology.
And what is ICP all about? God. In case you need a recap, this is a band of clowns rapping about killing people who are all about God and heaven. Oh, and they are owned by professional wrestling. I think that may be the least surprising aspect of the whole story. They have their own tournament. Finally, please enjoy this wikipedia article on ALLEGED juggalo violence.
What is a juggalo? An excellent question. The song lyrics explain here though there is a lot of debate online. Also there are a lot of petitions for better world treatment of juggalos. No, really.
Okay so generally, ICP is a joke. Do they think it’s a joke? I don’t know. Do fans? I think some do. But there’s actually one song on this album that has like, 8 references to good rap songs! And they have like 10 albums–that’s a lot of joke albums. So what about the religion? And I know people think ICP is stupid, and generally it may be, but what other band has the same:
- level of fan devotion (i.e. considered a religion or cult of Beatle-like proportions)
- level of organization (conferences and local events even without the band showing up)
- brotherhood associated with its fans
- literary criticism of lyrics and mythology
- ability to sustain popularity without radio airplay for over a decade
- joke albums that actually talk about serious things (religion, and children killed in gang violence)
This popularity makes me think that many people over 18 must like ICP unironically. I have to say having listened now to 2 of their albums they do have a few good songs, if you can get past the whole “we’re gangsta rapper clowns” thing (which is difficult). I consider myself very into music, and there are few bands I would pay to follow around who I love earnestly, let alone travel to go to events a band I like ironically would not even be at. What’s the draw? Why doesn’t Gwar have a similar following?
At lunch today, my friend Kurt theorized that it’s all a marketing ploy a la Hot Topic. Except the majority of the hype seems fan created, not ICP created. And, although this might be part of it, ICP lyrics seem to state frequently how much ICP doesn’t care if you like them or buy their records or action figures. Moreover, from all accounts, one of the members of the ICP is actually insane. Like, needs help, not for show, in a serious not funny way. Okay, way to turn your disability into a moneymaker, sir. I posit that the increasing number of kids taking psychological meds must have something to do with ICP popularity.
Basically, I can’t see buying a lot of cds for ten years and going to lots of shows and buying action figures 1. ironically and 2. if i was a teen/jobless pothead. People with actual money and real jobs must be buying the records. Why? I think ICP is a “lifestyle” that people buy into even if in real life they don’t kill bitches or even do drugs.
Kurt also mentioned that liking ICP would be a real rebellion against your parents, but I think if, as a teen, I put on wikid klown makeup, they would not have gotten angry, just confused. Also, there is such popularity for clown rap it’s a WHOLE GENRE. How is that possible? Say it’s crap all you want, but think of your favorite band, the band you would travel for. Is there enough of an audience to support 5 bands like them? I am guessing not.
From the ICP website:
“Their tale begins with poor suburban kids lost in the streets of Southwest Detroit, and peaks with over ten RIAA certified albums and DVDs, including the Billboard Top 200‘s longest running hip-hop album–an unprecedented success for a group with no major label support, and no radio or MTV airtime.”
Okay several points: first, again, their popularity is undeniable, beyond an ironic or teen audience. Second the suburban connection. The gathering of the juggalos is in Columbus, OH. It used to be in nowhere, MI. Nothing says badass rapper like camping in the Midwest, huh? Man, I feel so bad for poor kids IN THE SUBURBS?
I think crazy is the new punk rock. Basically, looking weird in high school isn’t weird anymore, because anyone can buy punk rock clothes pretorn at Hot Topic. Crazy, however, is frightening. School shooters are crazy! You can’t reason with crazy! Crazy is the opposite of the suburb urban planning where everything looks the same. In the whole suburban aesthetic many people are actually being medicated for mental illness and it’s a secret shame. Thus, I think part of the ICP appeal is being different through mental illness. Reclaiming mental illness and chaos in a physical construction that forces normalcy and homogeneity. Basically, ICP is “Heathers” for boys.
Or perhaps, Jesus is really behind ICP. This would explain their completely surprising popularity. From the final song of the the album:
Who invented Juggalos and Juggalettes and fucking Faygo showers? What about that feeling you get when bumping our shit, who’s behind the Juggalo powers? This ain’t no fucking fan club, it ain’t about making a buck. Don’t buy our fucking action figures bitch, I don’t give a fuck! It ain’t about Violent J or Shaggy, the Butterfly or 17. When we speak of ‘Shangri-La’, what you think we mean? Truth is we follow GOD, and have always been behind him. The Carnival is GOD and may all Juggalos find him!…..We ain’t sorry if we tricked you
Basically, I have to respect anyone who puts this much thought in their music, whether it’s to make a buck or not. I mean I would never thought up a religious cult of wicked clowns, ever. So, go ICP.
You know how historical periods and places produce certain genres of art (the Harlem Renaissance? The Original (OG) Renaissance? Surrealist Paris?)? ICP is the artistic result of the suburbs people! Rebellion through insanity. Put that in your carnie pipe and smoke it.
Well let me tell ya,
Juggaloes and juggalettes are a very rare source of people who follow the style and beliefs of such wicked ass underground rappers such as my favorite: TWIZTID…
We unite as a family, unlike those posers of some high strung group on MTV.
We keep it underground as long as the serial killin’ urge remains amongst us…………
Stay wicked…
Mary, you are a gentlewoman and a scholar of icp.
The carnival IS God. A real Juggalo has already found him
i don’t doubt it.
i don’t mean to be sounding mean or anything. but you really have no idea what you’re talking about. first off…not everyone who considers themselves a juggalo is an actual one. a lot of them are just stupid preteens who think that this is the next “cool” thing. it’s not. this is serious. what a lot of people don’t realize is that ICP and other Hatchetman groups consider the juggalos and juggalettes as family. what you also don’t seem to understand is that many (including myself) juggalos don’t believe in God. I, for one, am Buddhist. That’s not the point however. The point of being a juggalo is to live life the way you want. Love all who actually care about the world, and not those who don’t. By all, I don’t just mean other juggalos. I mean anyone at all. I mean people you’ve never even met, as long as they’re not total assholes.
In any case, I suggest actually researching this shit before you post it, rather than talking to your “friend” who i’m sure has an incredible amount of credentials in this field
In all honesty, I really don’t care what you think about any of this. You’re wrong about this. I know this. But I figure I should tell you so you know why your ass is being beaten when you say this to a juggalo’s face.
Hey–the annoying thing about espousing any philosophy is that you don’t get to pick and choose who says they follow it. Just like some Christians hate gay people and others say that hating isn’t Christian, those dumbass hot topic kids are juggalos. In fact, just like the xtan example they are the most well known juggalos. When people think juggalo, they think “stupid 15 yr old suburban wigger.” Sucks for you man. I honestly think that must suck.
However, my point was in agreement with you–that ICP isn’t just a joke band for 15-yr old Hot Topic kids. That people really did believe in it, and lots of mainstream people. How is that in conflict with what you are saying?
I personally highly support your disbelief in God, however, ICP IS into God. I DID do research. And the lyrics quoted, including:
“The Dark Carnival is GOD and may all Juggalos find him!”
are pretty god focused, at least starting around the 7th Joker Card.
Isn’t Buddhism about (in part) pacifism? Why the threats? If I don’t know what I am talking about you can just tell me without threating? I mean, man, it really makes me take juggaloism more seriously now that you resort to street violence.
So, in your opinion, who gets to decide who IS and IS NOT a juggalo? And why is it okay to disregard all of ICP’s discussion of God?
I am glad you have found something you really believe in and a family of people who you care about. That’s great.
Also, John, it’d probably be easier to believe you that Juggaloism was a more mainstream philosophy if you didn’t fit exactly into the whole suburban teenager ICP market.
or should i say scott? btw, that’s really nice that you volunteered for the lutheran church!
1. I did what? Lutheran Church? If you’re talking about CedarS Camps, that’s Christian Science, my parent’s religion, and my old one.
2. i’m not saying that I have the right to chose who is and isn’t a juggalo. I just think that people need to know what they’re saying before they say it. That also applies to me; thank you for pointing that out.
3. I’m only Buddhist in the sense that I listen to the teachings of Buddha and I am a practicer of Buddhist meditation.
4. I’m not necessarily out to defend Juggalos, because after some thought in the recent past, I have come to believe that I don’t like the term. Or the killing. I do however like the mindset, which is all that really matters.
Hmmmm k…. well there’s a few things here. There are only 6 joker cards so the “God thing” didn’t start at the 7th one lol
They do talk about God and believe in God but that doesn’t mean that since you are a juggalo you feel the same way since most juggalos knew nothing of their following until after Shangri-La. However Juggaloism isn’t a philosphy unless Deadheadism is. We’re just a group of people who relate and love music. I’ve written so many things trying to correct people and I think it’s to a point that I’m just worn out over this. You don’t understand maybe if you read Behind the Paint you’ll understand but my guess is is that you are nothing like us nor have been brought to a point where you would feel like us.
sorry, i did mistype. I was referring to the 6th–The Wraith, the song “Thy Unveiling.”
Have you read the lyrics to that album? Cuz they talk about god a lot. A LOT. Here I will quote more extensively:
“When we speak of Shangri-La, what you think we mean? Truth is we follow GOD, we`ve always been behind him, The Dark Carnival is GOD and may all Juggalos find him!
May The Juggalos Find Him!
May The Juggalos Find Him!
May The Juggalos Find Him!
He’s out there, He’s Out there! ”
About half the songs on that album could be titles of Gospel songs. That doesn’t mean you should believe in God, but it does mean that ICP is espousing a belief in God. I don’t know how that could be CLEARER?
RE: not being a philosophy, the previous poster would sort of disagree with you–I mean he mentioned that juggalos aren’t JUST fans of the music–there’s something more. I don’t think you can compare ICP fans (or juggalos) to the Dead, seeing as Deadheads didn’t dress in full makeup like Jerry Garcia.
When did I claim I was like you? Or that I felt like you?
There are a lot of other songs that talk about God other than “Thy Unveiling.” That just happens to be the most direct one. If you listen to “Hokus Pokus,” they talk about the end of the world after the unveiling of the last joker card.
In the end, it all boils down to your own personal belief. If you choose to believe this, have fun. If you don’t, that’s fine. I don’t think anyone, not even myself (lol) have the ability to choose that for you.
I totally agree. They talk about God quite frequently. But Kitten insists they do not, and that was the easiest quotation. And of course you SHOULD choose for yourself. Why would you do anything different?
Because people are intent on becoming just like everyone else…just look at any Junior High or High School. I think Juggalos are those who don’t listen to that whisper.
Hey, conforming to a group, no matter how non-mainstream, is still conforming. Again, I will reiterate my rule that if it’s sold at Hot Topic, it’s not underground or alternative, it’s mainstream. If they sell it in the Mall of America, it’s white bread suburban mainstream. I would direct you to the lyrics of Hot Topic Is Not Punk Rock.
I am glad you love their music, but don’t buy corporatization of a lifestyle as independent thinking.
It’s very difficult to talk about Juggalo’s as a group, when it isn’t possible to put them in one. I personally haven’t bought anything ICP or Psychopathic from anywhere. I will most likely buy a Hatchetman necklace from Ebay or something, but that’s most likely it.
Good song, by the way…I’ve heard it a few times.
It’s odd though. You can tell people what to believe about all of this, but the point of it is to believe what you want, not to be influenced by anyone or anything. Which is also interesting because most of “them” are influenced by each other. Many of “them” talk about being different from society, but what “they” fail to realize is that they’ve created a society of their own, and they aren’t different anymore.
well i hate to break it to you but that is very poserish to go and buy a fuckin hatchetman necklace but at the same time never buying any of their other shit. and also i hate to break it to you but dont you know there is more than one GOD!!!!!!!! you dont know for a fact if they talkin about the god that supposably lives in heaven, or any other god that might be out there and i hate to brake to u guys but dont talk shit about ICP or any juggalo’s or lettes b/c then u fucking with shit u dont know about.
Who are you talking to Insane–me or the other commenters?
not you Jenny but i do hate it when people talk about stuff that they dont know every detail to! i mean everyone has a right to their opion but, i gotta stick up for my family
But these people claim to be IN your family. It must be difficult to be so committed to your family and then also dislike a lot of people who claim to be members.
i know but they dont seem to be down all the way a true family member only goes threw bout a year of questioning…. but they soundnt talk down about our family like that. some of the shit they say dont make since i dont dislike them their family, but if your family dont be hatin……….
I have been a Juggalo for almost 6 years now and I have been watching the way the followers of ICP and those who try to claim that they are ‘Juggalos’ and ‘Juggalettes’.
This is my personal opinion and I can vouch for other true Lo’s and Lettes’ personal opinion as well: Being a Juggalo is about a lifestyle, not just about listening to ICP or any other Psychopathic [Records] artist. It is about the meaning of the songs. You can stand behind the same meanings and never ever heard a ICP song. It’s about living a good life, respecting other people, being yourself. Be grateful for everything you have, because not everybody has it as good as others. And what you have now could well be lost in one single day. Live your life from day to day, and enjoy every second of it. Help others who need help.
And for the whole God thing, listen to the reverse rapping. Example; Hell’s Pit, first song, you can here a preacher saying something. Reverse he is saying: “everybody needs to have some Jesus in their life…” Check that and other albums out for yourself.
The following text comes from the Shaggy 2 Dope interview:
Rude Boy: Tallica From Washington, PA, wants to know, now that you can buy Psychopathic shit in any store, including Spencer’s, Hot Topic, and all that type of places, do you think anyone should be able to get their hands on Psychopathic stuff and call themselves Juggalos? Or does that piss you off?
Shaggy: Why the fuck would that possibly piss me off? You know, I think having our shit in fuckin’ Hot Topics, and Spencers, and whatever fuckin’ store carries our shit, is the fucking bomb. If not for the simple fact because we get to pocket the loot, but the fact of the matter is, you could have kids that live in fuckin’ Butthole, Minnesota or somewhere like that that are very computer illiterate like me, that don’t go on the internet to buy shit, or don’t have a credit card to order shit off the internet. They’re broke, can’t make it to a show, or can’t afford to get in a show to buy shit, you know what I’m saying? Why shouldn’t they have the chance to represent some shit, too? You know what I’m saying? They could go down to the strip mall, or to the mall, to the Hot Topic and buy some shit. Why should that be wrong? And who’s who to judge what a real Juggalo is, anyway? As long as you a Juggalo, in my book, you’re a fuckin’ Juggalo.
Rude Boy: Yeah, because there’s a lot of hatin’ on it, you know.
Shaggy: I don’t give a fuck if you’ve been listening since Dog Beats, or if you’ve been listening since fuckin’ Hell’s Pit. You know what I’m saying? Juggalo ain’t just how down you are with ICP and the Hatchet. That’s part of it, of course, but what Psychopathic does, like we always say, whenever we’re talking about this shit, we support the background music for Juggalo parties, for the Juggalo world. We’re just the background music for it, you know?
Rude Boy: The soundtrack to people’s lives.
Shaggy: You don’t even to have to fuckin’ neccessarily listen to Hatchet shit to be a Juggalo. I mean, that’s bullshit. Juggalos are Juggalos. I think the whole fuckin’ situation about Juggalos battling with each other because somebody’s more down than another fuckin’ Juggalo is fucking stupid.
Read the whole interview here: http://www.insaneclownposse.com/carnival/print.php?page_id=icp_s2d_20050920
okay but theres one very true thing is u dont have to belive in god to be a juggalo or lette!!!! and its the fuckin truth ive been down for only 5 years going on to be 6 next month, and one thing i do know that evry lo and lette has there right to say what they wanna say….
InsaneLettes yes, you are correct. One of my closest friends, a Juggalette, she didn’t believe in God. But she believed that you create your own god. And you are the judge of your own destiny on the very own actions you make through out your own life. Just like the Jeckel Brothers.
—————————————————–
For who doesn’t know: The Amazing Jeckel Brothers is the 5th Joker’s Card.
The Amazing Jeckel Brothers are described as a duo of soul-jugglers in the afterlife. Jake the Just and Jack the Wicked juggle the bearer’s sins: those who sin too heavily and witness a fumble during the act are sent to Hell’s Pit, those who see the act completed go to Shangri-La.
—————————————————–
But what she believed didn’t have much of a relevance to me. Until last year when she was killed, crossing Foothill Blvd in Upland, CA. A driver stuck her going 60 mph. It messed with my sanity badly. But what she taught me made sense, and I could finally grasp it. And honestly, that was what made me know everything was going to be alright.
And Juggalos and Juggalettes DO do what they want. That’s one of the key ingredients to be one of us. Not a follower, not trying to be like everyone else in the mainstream lifestyle. Being yourself, doing and saying what you want when you want. Being true to you and the world. That’s it.
thank you zack to help me prove a point… and may clown love still be with ur friend… i know she is where she thought she should be!!!! i send you much clown love from me and my sis!!!!!
Not a problem InsaneLettes. Anything to have an oppertunity to share the truth of the Dark Carnival. Much clown love to you and your sis, and to all the other Juggalos and Juggalettes reading this. MMFCL
Zack if you feel like chatting about stuff just tell me!!! oh and i got a question me and a dude i grew up with, who is my homie decided he should stop talkin to me b/c his cuz dont like me!!!! and i rly want to Hurt her, b/c i might lose a rly good homie over her!!!!!! how should i handle this bitch
Email me at drk420carnival@yahoo.com
I AM A JUGGALETTE.I FOLLOW GOD AND WANT TO SENT MCL TO ALL WHO FOLLOW.
I AM A JUGGALO AND YOU BEST BELIVE ITS TRUE!!!! THE DARK CARNIVAL IS GOD!!!!!!!!!! READ THE FUCKING LYRIS TO DA SONGS WE CLOWNS PREACH GOD AND I FELL FOR ALL YA MOTHER FUCKERS WHO DONT BELIVE WHAT WE PREECH CUZ YOUR GONNA BE WAKEN UP ON SOME WHOLE OTHER SHIT IN SHANGRI LA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I DONT GIVE A FUCK WHAT ANY OF YOU PPL BELIEVE JUST CUZ I AINT MORMAN!!!!!!!!! EVERYBODY SAYS ALL YOU GOT TA DO IS PUT AN ICP SHIRT ON AND SAY YOUR DOWN WELL THAT MAY BE TRUE BUT GOD NO’S WHO WE REALLY ARE ALL YOU MORMONS HAVE TO DO IS STICK YOUR HEAD UNDER THE FUCKING WATER!!!!(NO AFFENSE MOM) BUT YEA I AM SICK OF ALL YOU HATERS SO PEACE OUT NINJA!!!!!!!!
MMFCL!!!!!!!!!*****************SHAY
PS I WILL NEVER GET ON THIS SIGHT AGAIN SO YOU MIGHT AS WELL NOT WRITE BACK
oh and i ment hells pit lol
MAN YOU GUYS ARE LUCKY JAY AND SHAGGY DONT READ THIS SHIT YOU ALL ARE DUMB!!!!!!!!!! OF COUSE WE BELIEVE IN GOD!!!!!!!!!
BRITTANIE YOU SEEM FUCKIN TIGHT MCL
damn you ppl r stupid me and every other juggalo or juggalette no this is all bout god hey dumb asses listen to the lyrics in songs against all shit like racism and our peace a shit goverment
check out the album the amazibg jeckel brothers the song terrible a da beside the language and murder stuff its a message the punisher marvel comics killed those who deserved not 4 fun like dat
from da mind of a 13 year old juggalo
and i mean in my above comment any god watever ur god is all shaggy and j r sayin is believe in something and do wat u want were a family thats wat we have the juggalo family and god watever that god is even if ur athiest like me u can still understand
HEY I WAS JUST BRANDED YESTERDAY BUT NOW I NEED MY FAYGO SHOWER DO U NO OF ANY JUGGALOS OR JUGGALETTES AROUND THE DUNDALK AREA LIKE AROUND WEST INVERNESS
THANX
well the heck is that??????? if i knew i’d help but idk were that is
I dated Zach from approximately 2003-2005. During that time he befriended an ICP follower whom I am certain had a huge impact on him. I find it funny that during my time of “knowing” Zach he would speak of this life style as evil and cult like yet he lived two lives as he now claims he too is an ICP follower. Not to mention Zach was brought up by two traveling ministers, surrounded by God’s love and Jesus’s teaching yet he follows this very satanic and confused cult which is disgusting and juvenille. You may wonder why I am speaking out after years of seperation from Zach, while I have married and moved on I am still and will forever be baffled by the multiple pesronalities he tends to thrive on. Please, come back down to earth.
Doenst anyone here know the fucking story of the butterfly? goddamn…thats where the whole Christianity shit started for them..so all of you are wrong fuck you…ICP is real and they believe in what they believe in, because they were inspired…search for the butterfly story then re say everything that has been said over the past fuckcing year.
and also…they have been preaching the shit ever since the begging, listen to the goddamn songs and understand them.
this is rediculous. Juggalos are brought together by psychopathic music, anyone who is a juggalo has been a juggalo since the day he was born. All ICP did was give a common name. a real juggalo isn’t conforming to anything. Not any 2 REAL juggalos are the same. It’s about believing in your own shit. All the killing in the songs are all commited on someone who deserve it. It’s not senseless. it’s not without reason. Their songs are guiding kids on a path of rightousness if you would just sit down and listen. Now i rep the hatchet all the time. shirts, hats, hoodies, whatever, but i do it hoping to get intouch with some lore ‘los. cause all the time when i see someone reppin i yell out to them and spark up a convo, and you fuckers who i called out to and ignored me, fuck you. Cause like jamie madrox said “you dissin the person you trying to be”
i being a juggalette would like to say YOU ARE AMAZING Jenny. Atleast you, unlike some people, take the time and attempt to understand us. Thank You
J said in an interview (and i quote)
” We been passin this carny bizz since 90 fuckin 2, and no one that we know believes this fakeness…. me or shaggz and passin no fuckin religion, so back off on this whole (carny cult) bullshit… ”
Shaggy 2 Dope later that year told interviewers (once again, I quote)
” Me and J are both Christians, the Dark Carnival is just for fun, trust me, I was there when we made the shit up…. “
Respectfully, that’s like Ice-T saying Cop Killer isn’t about killing cops. Maybe Jesus wasn’t the sentiment, however the lyrics are all about Jesus/heaven/etc. My guess was they meant it to be that way and it went over like a lead balloon so they backed away from it. Rap and Christianity have always had crossover, even if in a lot of cases it seems hypocritical. I think this is just another instance of it. I mean you can say what you want in interviews but the lyrics “the dark carnival is God” plainly disagree.